Who are Dorota and Krzysztof?

Krzysztof Skowroński and Dorota Skowrońska are a married couple from Warsaw. They run Real Poland, an inbound tour operator built around small group and private tours of Poland.

I met Krzysztof years ago, when I was a tour manager bringing a group of Silesian coal miners to Warsaw and he was our local guide. Many years later I helped them set up their first website, and I've been cheering them on ever since.

Krzysztof is a licensed guide who also worked as a limo driver, a driving instructor and in finance, and these days, he helps travelers with Polish roots trace their ancestors and sometimes meet living relatives after fifty or more years.

Dorota taught at a primary school and has translated around thirty children's books into Polish, most of them from Swedish, including the Sigge pony series by Lin Hallberg. She designs the itineraries that her guests rave about on Tripadvisor.

They ran their first own small group tour in 2014, survived three years of closed borders and war next door, shut the company down, and then reopened it because of one email. They run it the way many of us run our work: remotely, from a caravan, a highway, or a ski slope, with their two boys along for the ride.

Krzysztof, Dorota, and RealPoland

Polish identity and history

  • Polish Americans — the people Dorota means when she says you can feel Polish without speaking Polish
  • Polish diaspora — millions of people with Polish roots in the US, Canada, and Australia
  • Piotr Adamczyk — the Polish actor I keep spotting in Hollywood credits
  • For All Mankind — the Apple TV sci-fi show where he plays Soviet engineer Sergei Nikulov
  • Satellite state — how Poland was seen during the Soviet era
  • Buffer state — the "somewhere between Germany and Russia" idea I brought up
  • Iron Curtain — the line that left Krzysztof's generation feeling off the global mainstream
  • Partitions of Poland — how Poland disappeared from the map of Europe for over a century
  • National Independence Day — November 11, when Poland celebrates regaining independence in 1918
  • Solidarity — the 1980s movement that shaped how the world sees modern Poland
  • Balcerowicz Plan — the shock therapy behind Poland's free market transition
  • The Holocaust in Poland — the history Krzysztof heard firsthand from survivors he guided
  • Tchorek plaques — the WWII memorial plaques on Warsaw's walls that make history impossible to escape
  • Russian invasion of Ukraine — the war next door that scared travelers away again in 2022
  • Silesia — my home region, and where the miners from our first tour came from

Countries that do and don't exist

Places in Poland

  • Warsaw — home for Krzysztof and Dorota, and the start of their tours
  • Karpacz — the mountain town where the family took their caravan this year
  • Książ Castle — the largest castle in Silesia, near Wałbrzych
  • Old Mine in Wałbrzych — the coal mine museum they explored nearby
  • Miłomłyn — the tiny town where the email that saved their business arrived
  • Warsaw Chopin Airport — my go-to landing spot when flying from Asia to Europe
  • Tatra Mountains — where many of their tours end up, and a classic ski escape
  • Żabka — the Polish convenience store chain on every corner, and a meme my partner loves
  • PKP Intercity — the fast, clean trains that surprise their guests
  • Kremówka — the Polish cream cake people come back for
  • Pączki — Polish doughnuts, my other reason to come home

Their USA road trip

Malaysia and beyond

  • Kuala Lumpur — where I'm based right now
  • Hari Merdeka — Malaysia's Independence Day on August 31
  • Malaysia Day — September 16, when the federation was formed
  • State of Singapore — the two years Singapore spent as part of Malaysia
  • Prague — Krzysztof and Dorota's first trip together
  • Colosseum — Dorota's example of a sight you have to book a month ahead
  • Eiffel Tower — the Europe everyone sees in the movies

Travel industry, AI, and slow travel

Timestamps

00:00 Start.
00:59 How I met Krzysztof on a tour with Silesian miners.
02:33 What makes someone Polish: language, roots, or a last name?
04:10 Is Poland still seen as provincial?
09:13 How foreign visitors see Poland today.
12:41 The travel bug, family votes, and a Google Maps bucket list.
19:06 A US road trip without kids and why a week can feel like two months.
22:52 Krzysztof's obsession with countries that don't exist.
27:02 Living with history in Warsaw, and what Malaysia taught me.
32:31 War next door: does Poland still feel safe?
36:01 From guide and translator to tour operators.
41:49 2014: the first small group tour and their first child.
46:17 Their own vibe, then New York, Melbourne, and COVID.
51:05 Closed borders, war, and shutting down.
53:12 The email that arrived in Miłomłyn.
57:33 Old guests return, pączki, and tracing Polish roots.
1:02:13 Why travelers without Polish roots now choose Poland.
1:05:28 No crowds, Żabka, fast trains, and good-value hotels.
1:11:30 Warsaw as a gateway from Asia, and who RealPoland is for.
1:13:31 AI trip planners: great on screen, nonsense on the road.
1:17:49 Chatbot fatigue and the human touch as a luxury.
1:20:03 Running a tour company like digital nomads.
1:23:21 Why their way of working beats a 9-to-5.
1:25:17 Where to find RealPoland and a free Polish course.

Quotes

Even though I am absolutely sure we spend more time working than at a typical 9-to-5 job, it's on our own terms. So if I feel that I want to work at five AM and then have a little bit of life when there is sunshine and go for a walk, I can do that. I don't need to ask anybody for permission — Dorota
We get slow travel with our kids, we get intense travel together where you have like one week, but this week is like two months worth in your life —Dorota
Travel is sometimes a lot of unexpected situations. It's always good to have someone here who can react, who can adjust the plan. This is something that big companies don't give you and this is something that artificial intelligence actually makes more and more a luxury thing — Dorota
Our business is not like selling typewriters that at some point can be substituted by computers. Even if you go through a difficult or turbulent time, people will come back because people simply need to travel and explore —Krzysztof
Give yourself time, always time for at least a bit of physical activity, space for your own thoughts, and connection with different groups of people. It's not you that work for the protocol. It's the protocol that works for you — Krzysztof
Nowadays Poland is still a country where traveling is not part of the huge crowd. That's what makes Poland still a very pleasant place to visit — Dorota